Talks by Nirodbaran

14 October 1969

Well, I was very glad, very surprised to receive an invitation from you, through your charming teacher [Addressing the children of Progres].²⁴⁹ It seems, you even threatened to invade my small castle if she did not convey your invitation to me. I was glad because I would be able to meet you children, I was surprised because I didn't know why you had invited me! It seems you wanted me to give a talk. I was wondering whether it was because of my appearance, or for my talk that you have invited me. I was sure it is not because of my appearance, but because I can talk. So I seem to have gained some fame and reputation as a speaker. You understand my English? Yes. That is a bit of a surprise because when I was young, a child like you, I was supposed to be very shy and somewhat tongue-tied. You know what is tongue-tied? When I became a little older, after I passed out of school, I wanted to go to England. I had no father then, I'd lost my father when I was a child like you. I had a guardian, and when I suggested to him that I would like to go to England, he asked, "What for?" I replied, "I want to be a barrister." He said contemptuously, "Huh! Huh! A fellow who can't talk two words wants to be a barrister!" There you are! Either out of shyness or due to some other reason I could talk but I could not speak!

Similarly, when I came to see Mother, a number of years after my return from England, I met Her there for the first time, where Rajenda's library (Reading Room) is at present. Mother used to meet people there. That was the Darshan room. It seemed She was very happy and surprised to see me, and began to smile and she kept on smiling and I was feeling very uncomfortable! I was looking up

249 'Progres' is the name of a certain section in the Sri Aurobindo International Centre of Education.

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and looking down - once up and once down - and She kept smiling all the while; not a word was coming out of my mouth. Then She commented, "He is very shy." So a shy person, a dumb person like I am, has become a speaker. Is this not a miracle? So here is one more miracle before you.

There are many other miracles the Guru performed on me. I was a big ass, He has made me an intelligent ass; I was a medical man, He has made me a poet; so if these are not miracles, what are they? A fellow who could not write a single line of poetry has now become a poet. One who could not utter a single word, who used to feel shy in the presence of people, has now become a speaker. There is a verse which says: The Divine Grace can make a dumb fellow talkative, and one who is lame can be made to jump over a mountain.²⁵⁰ The Divine Grace, the Divine Power can do that. I did not believe this when I was a child; but now when I am a grown-up man, Sri Aurobindo has proved it to me by my own example.

In the former days of the Ashram, there was a lady - though she was not much of a lady -a woman of middle age. At that time, I was the doctor in charge of the Ashram Dispensary. She used to come to the dispensary and bother me much. She was a quarrelsome woman, she used to fuss over nothing; she was fat, squat and bulky. By the way, you know Promod Babu Chatterjee's house?²⁵¹ She used to live there. She used to cook for Sri Aurobindo nice 'luchis' and she took great pride in it. "I cook luchis for Bhagawan!" and with great gusto she used to distribute prasad to everybody. You know what 'prasad is - Bhagawaris prasad.²⁵² That is why that house is named 'Prasad House'. As I said, she used to cook for Sri Aurobindo and that's how her pride began to swell. She used to quarrel with almost everybody, not sparing me, and used to complain to Mother. One day - as you know I was a doctor and also I was with Sri Aurobindo, doing Him some service, so I was in Sri Aurobindo's presence even that day. She

250Mookam karoti vachalam, pangum langhayati girim.

251Present day 'Prasad House'

252Sweets, etc., that have been offered to God with prayers and then distributed among the worshippers as God's blessings.

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came up running to the Mother: "Mother, Mother!" she said. "What's the matter?" "See, Mother." She was carrying a big bottle of medicine. "Doctor Nirod has given me this. How to take, how many times to take it, nothing has been said. Mother, Mother, he is no doctor, he is a poem he is a poem!" (Laughter) So Mother came with a smile, told this story before Sri Aurobindo and I was there. So there you are, even that lady gave me that tribute of being a poet, though she didn't mean it as a tribute. She didn't know the distinction between a poem and a poet - so she said that I was a poem! (Laughter)

That reminds me of many things, but one thing in particular. As I said, she was very quarrelsome, used to quarrel with everybody, and each time she would threaten to jump into the sea. I am quite sure that the sea would have refused to take her! (Laughter) She was so bulky, she would have been too heavy even for the sea! Anyway, she used to write letters in Bengali to Sri Aurobindo, addressing Him as 'Baba'. She would write that such and such a thing happened, so if you don't do something, 'I will commit suicide, I will jump into the sea.' And poor 'Baba' used to be very affectionate and write sweet letters in Bengali, saying, 'If you commit suicide, who will prepare luchis for me ?' So she was satisfied, "Ah, Baba has said 'Who will prepare luchis for me, so I won't commit suicide.'" That is the story. I have strayed far away from our subject to something quite different. That's the trouble with old men. I'm sorry, my friends don't like that I should call myself old, but I can't help it, that is why I seek the company of young people. They give me something of freshness, something of life, something of cheer, so I forget that I am old. That is one of the reasons why I accepted this invitation. It is not that only I give you, you give me also something, unconsciously and very graciously, because children are very kind, very gracious, and very frank; they are very beautiful. Now, can you give me a watch? Otherwise I'll go on talking.

Now, today I'll tell you the story of a child, a somewhat big child, not very wise either. Some of you at least know this big child, whose name is Nishikanto - you know him? All of you know him? Good! He is a friend of mine, a poet, and has remained a child in spirit. You've

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seen how he dresses himself; though in spirit he is young, his body has become old. But it doesn't matter if the body is old, so long as the spirit is young. I too feel quite fresh and young in spirit. It doesn't matter if you suffer, it doesn't matter if you fail, but freshness of the spirit is what you must have, what you must maintain.

Now Nishikanto and I came to be friends. The way it happened is a very interesting story. It is a very long story which I've written, but I'll tell you just the important part. He was, before coming here, in Shantiniketan. In fact, he was brought up there from when he was a young boy. And he was a great favourite of Tagore and Nandalal Bose the great artist, as well as Abanindranath Tagore. Nishikanto was both a poet and an artist. I think he does some sketches even now; if you are interested, when you go to Corner House, you can pay him a visit and look at his face. Well, he was a poet even at a young age, he was a born poet. You know what a born poet is ? Right from his mother's womb, he was into poetry. That's what we call a born poet. I'm not a born poet, I have been made into a poet. There is a big difference between the two.

So Rabindranath became very fond of him because he showed a great power of genius. Abanindranath and Nandalal also grew very fond of him. But as he grew older, somehow he felt that Shantiniketan was not the place for him. He was then twenty or twenty-one years old. However, he stayed on as long as he could; Tagore used to call him very often to his house. He gave him good food and Nishikanto the poet has this weakness - he is very fond of good food. I'll tell you later on about it. Even now, though he is not well, he is very fond of it, so don't tempt him with rasagollas! So Tagore used to invite him, call him, read out his own poems which were very striking. Tagore used to ask for his judgment and his opinions. One day, Tagore had written a Bengali novel and he asked Nishikanto: "I have a hero - a character, what name do you suggest for him?" He said, all on a sudden, without thinking, "Nirodbaran!" You know I suppose that my name is Nirod and Baran. He didn't know anything about me at all. As soon as he uttered the name 'Nirodbaran' (he occasionally sees visions of gods

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and goddesses and other figures), a face floated before his eyes - a luminous face. Very strange! Then after some time - I'm cutting the story short - he left Shantiniketan. Tagore tried to tie him down, to bind him down in so many ways, but he couldn't. So, one day, he ran away.

He went to Sarnath near Bodhgaya where Buddhist people come on pilgrimage. There he stayed for some days. One day, he was meditating on the bank of the river Niranjana; deep-plunged in meditation, he saw Buddha's figure appearing before him and telling him: "I am not confined only to this place." He understood the meaning of that sentence. It meant that he need not be only there, he could go elsewhere in search of Truth. But there, in Sarnath, he met a friend of mine who told him about me, in their talk, that a friend of his is in Pondicherry, whose name is Nirodbaran. So now he understood the significance of the name that he had uttered without knowing. "Now I must go to Pondicherry from where the call comes." So he started for Pondicherry.

You see how the Divine works. That is what I am trying to drive at. When you are destined for something, you are guided to that destiny by various ways, by ways that you are not conscious of. So, one day, he came here, knowing nothing about our Ashram except one name - Nirodbaran. Who is Nirodbaran? What is he like? What does he do? My friend had told him only this much: "Nirodbaran is there, if you want to go, you may go. Tell him about this." Then, somehow, he managed to come here. I was staying at that time in the house where Ranju-da stays now. So, one fine morning, I find this gentleman coming to my place; he was rather bulky, with a suitcase in hand; he had a chador²⁵³ put across his chest like a Bengali babu, and his gait was a little self-conscious, conveying the air of being 'somebody'. And he had his hair in a bob - in Shantiniketan, poets keep that hairstyle. So he came up and asked, "Are you Nirodbaran?" I looked up and said, "Yes." "I've come to see you." Then he told me that so and so had sent him, had told him about me. At that time, remember, the Ashram was

253 A shawl-like cloth to covet the upper part of the body.

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quite different - not like the Ashram of today; now whenever you like, you can go to Ganpatram,²⁵⁴ whenever you like, you can go to the bazaar, etc. At that time, it was absolutely different, it was impossible to do such things. There was no Ganpatram. Even if I had a cup of tea, I would feel guilty; now I can take ten cups of tea without feeling anything. Anyhow, at that time, the rule was that no outsiders should be allowed into a sadbak's room. Now you can take as many outsiders as you wish! That was the rule of the Ashram then. So I could not take him into my room. I put a chair in the verandah outside, and said, "Let us sit here and let us talk." Then we had a long talk, after which I took him to Nolini-da, who was the Secretary of the Ashram. I was hoping that Nolini-da would be able to do something for him, if possible. He had come like a vagabond, with very little money. It was not known whether Mother would allow him to stay in the Ashram and give him a room, etc. Then it was reported to the Mother, and She said, "No, I can't give him a room. If he wants to stay on, let him stay outside and have his own food and room. I can't accept him." Poor fellow, but he was not discouraged. He took a room somewhere, a very dingy, small room full of mosquitoes and perhaps a bed full of bugs, but he didn't mind it at all. So he stayed on, cooking for himself. Then Dilip Kumar Roy came to know about it; that such and such a great poet has come here from Shantiniketan; he had made a name for himself in the outside world at that time. So Dilip-da and somebody else went to see him. You see how the Divine Grace works. And Dilip-da was very much impressed by his talk and by his poetry which he showed him. Then he came back and wrote a long letter to Sri Aurobindo pleading on his behalf, saying that he was a genius, and if not a genius, at least he had great possibilities; so why not accept him in the Ashram?

Mother was managing the Ashram at that time, so Sri Aurobindo told the Mother about Nishikanto. Mother sent Nolini-da to him to get some information from him. She said, "Ask him if he has, at any time, seen any sannyasi or lived with a sannyasi." Mother knew nothing of it, remember that. He hadn't written any letter to Her,

254 Cottage Restaurant.

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nothing of this sort had been told to her. Then Nolini-da went to him and asked him, "Mother wants to know if you have ever lived with a sannyasi? Then Nishikanto said, "Yes, when I left Shantiniketan, I went somewhere to the north and I met a sannyasi and I lived with him for some time. I asked the sannyasi if I could be accepted as his disciple and he said 'No baba, I won't accept you as my disciple. (Amaar ghore tomaar chal nei'²⁵⁵ - that is what they say in Bengali - it means you are not for me.) I see behind you your Guru and the Mother - they're your Gurus'. You see how yogis have this faculty. "So my child, don't go about here and there seeking for gurus, your gurus are fixed for you. And when the time comes, you will find them, go back home, my child, and lead a quiet life." So Nolini-da came and reported the story.

How did the Mother know about it ? That is not difficult to answer: Mother, being the Divine, knows everything that we are doing. Just try to understand - with Her sitting over there in one room, not going out anywhere, have you ever thought how it is possible to run this whole Ashram of 1500 people ? And without coming in contact with them! Had it been any other place, there would have been a big row, a big fight, a big head-breaking and yet you see nothing of all that here. Have you children ever thought of it? You do some mischief, that's all - how much freedom you are getting. Mother loves you, gives you directions but never comes much in contact with you physically, and yet what nice and beautiful and cheerful children you are. How is it so? Whenever you do something wrong, there is some unease in the heart. Isn't there? Just think! One simple thing makes you feel so uneasy, and the Ashram, containing 1500 people, having so much freedom, is still running so smoothly ? Not for fear of X, nor for fear of Y, but it is for the love of the Mother that you are so nice. Her love is everywhere, Her will is everywhere. That's what you are not conscious of at times, but sometimes, I suppose, you consciously feel it. She's doing so much for us. That love is the great power that is keeping us all united in this way. You are quarrelling and you lose your temper, at

255 Literally it means: "I have no food for you in my house."

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once you feel something there, something has gone wrong which you should not have done and should not do, not out of love for yourself but out of love for Mother and love for Sri Aurobindo. There are many other things, if you come to think of it, but one thing alone you can, even you children can understand - that She has such a great Power. Power of love, power of knowledge, power of peace, anything that you want from Her She gives you - the power to cure your illness even. In return, She wants that you should be nice, you should love God, you should love the Divine and try to do little by little everything for Her, for the Divine, for God, not for yourselves; not for your name, not for your fame, not for your reputation, not for your glory; this is what She expects from all of us.

However, let me come back to the story about Nishikanto. In those days, Mother used to walk on the big terrace and we used to stand below and look at Her. One day, Nishikanto was also standing somewhere in the corner and he saw the Mother for the first time and "Ah!" he exclaimed. "This is the Mother I have seen in my dreams and in my visions. It is She." Mother also saw him, but the answer to Dilip-da's letter came in a not very happy tone. Sri Aurobindo wrote for the Mother, that it is better that Nishikanto does not remain here. This is not his path. He will have a lot of trouble, a lot of suffering, a lot of pain, so let him go somewhere else. But Nishikanto was very stubborn, very strong - "Nothing doing, I'll stay here. It doesn't matter if I have suffering, I will stay here." Then it was told to Mother that he wants to stay here, and she wrote back; these were Her words: "All right, but tell him that he will see and know many things." That means not book knowledge, but visions of gods, goddesses and other forces; just as he saw the 'luminous face of Nirod' earlier. It may be my divine face which stays somewhere far away, God knows where; and he saw Buddha too. So Mother said that all these things he'll see, but seeing is not always very blissful. If you see, for instance, an apsara²⁵⁶ -finished! So there are big dangers too. And anyhow they warned him,

256 Heavenly dancer - incredibly beautiful and fatally attractive, as per Indian mythology.

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and said that he should take care.

So he stayed on here and went on sketching and writing poetry. He is a great poet, he is a great painter, he is a great cook and he is also a great 'petook'!²⁵⁷ I'm not exaggerating at all. Poor fellow has no control over his tongue - both ways. If you go and ask him something, he will go on telling you stories one after the other, like a grandpa: "Bujhechho, bujhechbo, Nirod, bujhechho'i"²⁵⁸ It goes on in this way. It's difficult to come away. No control over the tongue. Same problem also when you cook before him. Don't invite him, never invite him please! Never! Never! Nobody would invite him, for everybody knew about his greed, yet he used to come to our house or elsewhere and say, "Kicbhu khabar achhe? Kichhu dao khete!²⁵⁹ He is not like me - no shyness. So everyone was warned by the doctors and by the Mother that Nishikanto must not be given any food. But he used to get information whose birthday it was, and at that time would appear and the poor ladies could not refuse! He had no control over his tongue in this way as well.

So there are many stories about him, but all those will take us a long way off from what I want to say. Now, as I said, he is a great cook. His yoga was writing poetry. One day, after Sri Aurobindo's accident, neither he nor I could write any poetry. So he was thinking what to do and said he would cook. At that time in the Dining Room, a cook was badly needed, so Nishikanto was gladly taken. Mother said, "Very good idea, go," and he started cooking. And Sri Aurobindo gave him a great compliment (because they used to make 'prasad'm the Dining Room) that he was an excellent cook! Of course, we knew about his cooking expertise, because we used to hold parties and he used to cook for us, and we ate and enjoyed. He was an excellent cook! But he could not retain the post of cook for long. There again he stumbled, he tripped. After he had cooked or as he was cooking, he used to taste everything, so the ladies used to protest, "How dare you taste these

257Glutton.

258Have you understood - in Bengali.

259Is there anything to eat? Give me something to eat - in Bengali.

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things before they are offered to the Divine ?" They couldn't bear it, but he couldn't bear it either. He said, "How am I going to know that the cooking is good or not, if I do not taste it ?" So the quarrel went on; finally, the ladies won and he had to leave. That's all.

Then he started trying all sorts of experiments in cooking, preparing cheese for Mother, cooking something for one, cooking something else for another. And that led to his undoing', as we said. One day, he said, "I will prepare vinegar - strong acid - very sour." His idea was to prepare vinegar to make curds with which he would prepare cheese for Mother. What kind of cheese, I don't need to tell you! Now, he was preparing vinegar in an original way: from mangoes. So he used to pluck raw mangoes and boil them; you know how sour raw mangoes are! And he used to put some sugar in it. Then, one day, he drank a big glass of concentrated, strong, sour mango juice, and you know what happened! At once, there was a strong pain in his stomach and it began to bleed. He had an ulcer - that means a hole was made in the stomach, you understand? That's what happened. You know something of chemistry? If you take a strong acid and put it on the skin, what happens? It burns, doesn't it? Similarly here, his stomach lining just got burnt away, and it began to bleed. So the queer fancy he took brought about the beginning of a disease. That is why I used to call him 'Asura! That is the asuric power. How could any sane man think of taking a strong liquor, just out of fancy to taste it ? So it ended in an ulcer!

I told you earlier that he was a 'petook' - you know what that means - he could eat two big dishes of rice, sweets, etc., at a time, and then he never did any exercises like you children do, and he grew a tummy like that of Ganesh. Over and above that, as he was a painter, he used to just sit cross-legged and paint, day in and day out. All this with no physical exercises, mind you. Then I told him, I prophesied: "Look here, Kobi (I call him 'Kobi'), if you go on in this way, you'll have another disease called diabetes, I warn you." And my prophecy came true. On the one hand, ulcer in the stomach, on the other hand, diabetes. Finally, today he has no proper lungs, both his lungs have hundreds of holes, and he

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has a heart that may stop any time. Doctors have warned him: "Take care, your heart may stop any moment." It has almost become like a chicken heart! So his lungs are not functioning, his heart is almost on the point of stopping, his liver is out of gear, his stomach has a big hole, his kidneys have many small holes. So not a single organ is intact. Every hour or every two hours, he feels a pain in the stomach, a burning pain. So he carries some biscuits in his pocket; as soon as the pain starts, he chews them. The other day, he had forgotten them and came and asked me, "Have you any biscuits ?" I said, "I'm sorry, I don't have." With clock-like regularity, the pain comes. So this is the way he is going on.

There is a long story still to be told, but perhaps I shall tell you some other day. Now this is the present condition and yet, my friends, what I want to tell you is this, that his greed itself has punished him, for his 'petookami'! You can see that, can't you? Now he can't enjoy food: no rasagollas, no sweets, very small quantity of rice, that's all. That is one lesson you should learn, my children, that you will be punished for your gluttony. He did not realise it then, now he is realizing it. So he has become a walking patient now! But you have marked, I suppose, how happy and cheerful he is. That is the striking thing about Nishikanto. He doesn't care whether he dies or whether he lives. Can you ever imagine such a man? When I have a headache, I turn, I groan, I lament, "Ma re, Baba re!"²⁶⁰ I call Guru, "Save me!" Whereas this poor fellow: not a single organ is healthy and yet how happy, how cheerful he is. He goes about walking, goes to the bazaar, comes to my room, comes to the Samadhi with a stick and a lungi²⁶¹ put on like a Mussalman. That is one thing you have to learn from him, how a man in his condition can bear all this. How is it possible ? Because he has complete faith, complete trust and confidence in the Mother. "It doesn't matter whether Mother will let me die, I don't care! I don't fear!" So that is the root cause of all happiness in life, my children. That is a bright, shining example of how a man can be happy

260Oh Mother, Oh Father! - in Bengali.

261A lower garment worn mostly by Indian men, similar to the dhoti.

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in spite of all troubles - and physical troubles are the most difficult in the world to bear, you know that.

One day, he told us that he was going to the Lake Estate. His ulcer was bleeding, blood was flowing, he could feel it, and it was paining, but still he continued walking. Then he came and reported to the Mother all that had happened, then the Mother asked, "How is it that with that bleeding you went on walking to the Lake?" Then he answered, "Why not, Mother, I am the child of Mahakali!" Mother said, "That is all right - then it is all right." It is not a show, my children, it is not bravado. He does see the Mother as Mahakali, the Divine.

The other day, I proposed to him, "Kobi, give up all these ideas! Some Frenchman has come; he has some power to heal, go to him. He will heal you, he will give you some relief." He thundered at me, "What, Nirod, you tell me such things? You ask me to go to him? When I have my Mother and my Sri Aurobindo, you ask me to go to that man? If Mother can't cure me, can that fellow cure me? Never!" So you see what a strong, unshakable faith he has.

Well, children, my story isn't finished yet, but the time is over. On another day, God willing, I will finish the story.