Evening Talks with Sri Aurobindo

13^th December, 1938 (conti.)

as they begin meditation. For example R. and C. Even P. when he used to join became unconscious of the body.

Sri Aurobindo  :  Some yogis require a support to prevent their bodies from falling while they are in meditation. Those who practice Asanas can remain erect. 

There are some who go to sleep standing like the horse. My grand-father, Raj Narayan Bose, was like that. One day we were walking together at night. Suddenly we missed him. When we came back we saw him sleeping standing.

Disciple  :  It is a question of habit and convenience, I think.

Disciple  :  Was Raj Narayan practicing meditation?

Sri Aurobindo  :  Not much. It was a Brahmo-meditation. (Laughter)

Disciple  :  Sometimes meditation used to come to me spontaneously at my place and I used to get into a condition when I would be compelled to sit down to meditate.

Sri Aurobindo : It was probably the inner being insisting on it. It is always better to allow it to work.

Disciple : It used to happen even when I would be leaving for my work. For days I used to feel that my head was resting on the Mother's feet. What is that?

Sri Aurobindo : It was the experience of Psychic Bhakti.

Disciple : But then it went away. How to retain that experience?

Sri Aurobindo : The condition is "to want that and nothing else." If you have that intense passion for union with the Divine then it can remain. It is too difficult, is it? So, it is better to allow the higher Power to work.

Disciple : We have been trying hard to make him remain here for three months but he is all the time thinking of his family

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Disciple : I felt a pull upward in the head while meditating.

Sri Aurobindo : It is the mind trying to ascend to the Higher consciousness.

Disciple : Sometimes I feel myself widening.

Sri Aurobindo : Yes, sometimes one feels the head opening or expanding. That is the sign of the mental being opening to the Power.

Disciple : Sometimes I see sky, ocean, or mountains and forests.

Sri Aurobindo : Yes. One sees many things i.e. by the inner sight. These are symbols of life or energy. Sky is the symbol of the mind. Mountain is the symbol of the being with its different planes and parts with the Divine as the summit. Forests are symbols of the vital.

Disciple : These visions are seen by many (quite common).

Sri Aurobindo : Oh yes, as the mind expands so also the heart expands and also the vital. If one sees those things outside oneself then that has only symbolic significance but if one feels the widening or coming of Light in himself then that increases the opening and the receptivity of the being.

Disciple : What do you mean by the Divine or the Supreme?

Sri Aurobindo : I mean by it a consciousness of which the Gita speaks as Param Bhavam, Purushottama, Parabrahman, Paramatman. That is to say, the origin and the support and cause of every thing. It is Omnipotent, Omnipresent, everywhere, You can't define it. You limit it if you define it. It can be described as Sachchidananda. It is everything, it is everywhere, it is in everything. It is impersonal, 'Neti, Neti;' it is also 'Iti, Iti'. You can have the experience of Sachchidananda on any plane. These things cannot be known by the mind or by discussion. The "Golden lid has to be broken".

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Disciple : What will happen if one realizes the divine consciousness?

Sri Aurobindo : First thing, you will become calm, quiet; secondly, there will be the feeling of strength, I mean the presence of a Force. Thirdly, the sense of the Infinite will be felt, you will feel yourself as the Infinite. Fourthly, something will be always there behind which will be able to govern the nature. Also the sense of Eternity and of yourself as Immortal. Even though the body dies you know you are immortal. Also there are many things more. For example, freedom from every thing even from the world. You realize the Transcendental and the Universal consciousness.

Realization of the fundamental being may be the beginning i.e. of the Essential being, Consciousness and Delight. Then, everything is divine, you are divine, you live in the divine : it is one of the most Anandamaya experiences. It is a concrete and real thing and not an idea. You cannot explain these things. You can't explain even a stone in spite of your science. Everything is not material but mystical at bottom.

Disciple : Is it that this experience formulates itself differently in different Yogis to suit their personalities? or the difference is due to nature or personality itself?

Sri Aurobindo : There, personality is no longer separate. It is the One putting itself forward with a special quality, stress or that.

Disciple : You have also spoken of the veil in the heart.

Sri Aurobindo : It is also true. It sometimes requires removing the veil and breaking the wall (in the heart).

Sometimes after this experience of opening it seems to close again. Most of the obstruction comes from the

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vital. So, the being is prepared behind the veil and when everything is ready it is projected in the outer nature. But the demand of this Yoga is much more than in any other and so it takes a long time. All yoga requires patience above everything else.

Disciple : We must have been working for it for many lives.

Sri Aurobindo : According to some yogas you have no right to the result for twelve years. After twelve years you have to see if anything has happened or not.

Disciple : When the preparation is being done behind, can we say that some of the Sadhaks have achieved very great advance like the Vedic Rishis.

Sri Aurobindo : How do you mean? Their outer nature is not ready and so they can't be said to have realized the Truth. Nature is full of difficulties and obstacles and so the Higher Power works behind. If it worked in the outer nature, it would meet too many obstacles.

Disciple : So it is the Bhedabheda philosophy?

Sri Aurobindo : It is not merely philosophy, but the fact is there corresponding to the philosophy. The Gita speaks of it as "Avibhaktam Vibhkteshu Vibhaktam iva cha Sthitam", "Undivided in the midst of divided things, appearing as if divided." This is not an illusion. I see a tree. The tree appears to me as separate from me. But it is the One, because one with Him. It is myself. It is something else than a tree. It is impossible to think of it as something else than the Brahman.

When I cast my eyes round the room everything, – objects and the persons –, appears the Brahman. I call you so and so but you are not that.

Ordinarily, one tags on everything to the "ego". But in that higher state you understand the divine working

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better than when you are a separate "ego". It is when you can become "nobody" and have experience of the Divine that you can be free. That is Mukti. I realized the One, my self disappeared. It is difficult to think of my self as so and so, son of so and so. It is a relief and freedom to be "That" and to remain in "It".

Disciple : Can it be called Shankara's Vedantic realization?

Sri Aurobindo : About Shankara's Vedanta, the difficulty is that there are different explanations by various people. The world is an illusion–and the Illusion is indescribable. This is the common basis of all Shankara Adwaita–monism. According to him soul also is Maya–as it has no real existence. But I found that the experience behind this idea is quite different. I had that experience at Baroda, and if I had stopped there I would have been an orthodox  Vedantin.[ Shankar's followers disagree. According to Sri Aurobindo, God is one and many at the same time – they may say, "a logical contradiction". So is Maya – true and false at the same time. That also is a logical contradiction.]

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